[Dialogue] All about Institutional Survival

[Margaret Helen Aiseayew]

Yes, Marshall.  The teacher of this series was at least 40 years out of sinc (in my opinion).  The University of Dubuque Theological Seminary (basically Lutheran and not accredited to graduate Methodist ministers) offers a two week Methodist credentialed (sp?) program to meet conference continuing ed requirements.  Can't remember when I felt so like I had been boxed in to wasting my time and energy.  I wrote the bishop and told him so.  Felt compelled to argue with the "Wesley" scholar over such absurdities as pennies in the offering plate (not to mention prevenient grace).  Some seminaries may be deconstructing themselves.  Margaret
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: W. J. 
  To: Colleague Dialogue 
  Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 10:47 PM
  Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Recent discussions about identity and institutions


  A fascinating story, Margaret. I'm curious to know who the "usual suspects" are, and where you are taking these courses. Sounds like their institutional vision (such as it is) is still biased by what Peter Berger called "the suburban capitvity of the churches" over 40 years ago.

  Margaret, you should be teaching this class!

  At least the prof hit the nail on the head about E.I., even if he didn't approve of "radically calling the church to be the church in any and all of its circumstances." As though that had nothing to do with institutional arguments about having ecumenical tea parties.

  Maybe it's time to work on deconstructing the hidden premises of seminary education. Is it really about institutional survival and maintenance?

  Marshall Jones

  Margaret Helen Aiseayew <aiseayew at netins.net> wrote:
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: "frank bremner" 
    Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 12:25 AM
    Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Recent discussions about identity and institutions
    > I'm grateful that this discussion is proceeding.

    Frank,
    I glad someone is grateful the discussion is proceeding. I promised myself 
    that I would not intrude upon it again, but the very day you sent this post 
    I had a conversation with one of the professors of a seminary course I was 
    taking. I guess I was rather hard on them and this particular professor had 
    knocked everything ecumenical that anyone had mentioned for two weeks. I 
    decided to corner him with the suggestion that his negativity in this regard 
    could discourage other students in efforts that might prove very beneficial 
    to their communities and eventually their congregations, quite apart from 
    his continual push for the immediate result of increased numbers within the 
    congreagation which was always his push. We had a lively disagreement. He 
    finally turned to me and asked what was my experience with Ecumenism that 
    made me such ardent advocate?

    I said that I was a staff member of the Ecumentical Institute. His eyes 
    turned into saucers and he said, "E.I.?" I said many people had referred to 
    us as EI. He sputtered and stuttered and sputtered through some half 
    questions to make sure that I wasn't taking about some other EI and then 
    declared, "Well, the Ecumenical Institute didn't have anything to do with 
    ecumenism. I mean it didn't have anything to do with anything that I have 
    been calling ecumenical in class. It only had to do with radically calling 
    the church to be the church in any and all of its circumstances."

    I can only say that the conversation did not accomplish anything for which I 
    had hoped. Over the remainder of the courses I became clear that this was 
    someone who had encountered us long ago and never gotten beyond the offense 
    (or guilt?). He basically dismissed anything I had to say in the remainder 
    of the classes as either being too radical for the average local 
    congregation or as setting myself apart from normal people by sharing my 
    experience.

    Some institutional images don't fade.
    Sometimes your identity is someone else's projection (or defense). 


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