[Dialogue] Did NOT WORK????
KroegerD at aol.com
KroegerD at aol.com
Tue Mar 11 13:03:28 EDT 2008
In a message dated 3/10/2008 8:18:10 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
abatica at hotmail.com writes:
Folks,
Wiegel will always be part of the Church. I think we need to "re-chart" and
discuss the Niebuhr paper, and one more time...de-mythologize "church".
BTW, who has an extra copy of the paper?
Addi
in Minneapolis
____________________________________
From: KroegerD at aol.com
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 18:32:19 -0400
To: dialogue at wedgeblade.net
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Did NOT WORK????
If there is a "renewed" church in the Minneapolis area, I'd like to know the
name.
Dick Kroeger
In a message dated 3/10/2008 7:59:25 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
rcwmbw at yahoo.com writes:
Where do we find the "church" (ala Niebuhr) today? It is seems not to be,
with some noteworthy exceptions, the cigar boxes with steeples, and I am "in a
church" to use Dick's words. Randy
Richard Alton <dick_alton at hotmail.com> wrote:
Margaret, you must be right! The only problem with Jim is that he is not in
a church! Dick
Richard H.T. Alton International Consultants and Associates 'building global
bridges' 166 N. Humphrey Ave, Apt, 1N Oak Park, IL 60302 T:1.773.344.7172
richard.alton at gmail.com Don't let the fear of striking out hold you back Babe
Ruth
____________________________________
From: aiseayew at netins.net
To: dialogue at wedgeblade.net
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 20:06:59 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] Did NOT WORK????
Jim, surely you did not say that. Some one of those fundamentally sinful
people John mentioned commandeered your computer, right?
I just finished a four meeting strategic planning with my smallest
congregation. There are only fifteen members. We met with never more than seven at a
session through blizzards, ice storms, blizzards and frigid cold. Only one
member (and myself) were at every session. Ten of the fifteen were there
for at least one session. They struggled with vision, but they really got into
the contradictions and concluded that they were not out to declare the Word
with every activity of the church and that they had not embraced the new
challenges of their diversity. This was in adddition to confessing that they
were tired and skeptical of a plan that might demand more than they had left to
offer.
I could talk about the authenticity of this process and struggle for hours.
I couldn't be more proud. We decided on two new events, a regular study
that will last six weeks starting after Easter and two Family Fun Saturday
afternoons that will reach out to the whole neighborhood. We'll evaluate in six
months and see where we are. That they managed to move off the dime is
miraculous. That the church has been their sustenance for centuries, that they
are still sustaining it and waiting, willingly praying is equally miraculous.
The journey to Jerusalem never ends. We are once again on our way to
Jerusalem and I have been asking for most of a lifetime of myself and others if we
were ready, truly ready for the crucifixion. This last week I was so sick
with the flu and trying to take a relationship to Lazarus' story that it felt
like a mighty intervention of the father himself and his question has been,
Are we ready for the resurrection?
----- Original Message -----
From: _James Wiegel_ (mailto:jfwiegel at yahoo.com)
To: _Colleague Dialogue_ (mailto:dialogue at wedgeblade.net)
Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2008 12:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Fine editorial
too bad the local church / galaxy strategy did not work. There would be
ecclesiolas in every "cigar box with a steeple" at every cross roads and local
caring people all across the country would have access to a deeper formation
in what is going on than seems currently available re: depth study,
reflection, conversation, etc.
John Cock <jpc2025 at triad.rr.com> wrote:
Amen! to a fine editorial, Diann. Thanks.
But believe there is and will be more villainous, depraved, and vicious
stuff coming than just slurs about racism, sexism, religionism, Christianity-ism,
USA-ism, military-industry-ism, party-ism, and my-candidate-ism. Hate,
divisiveness, and profiteering can't wait to get out of the box -- with campaign
permission -- and go crazy.
Is this sort of evil potentially in all of us? Nah! Sounds like hard-core,
die-hard, fundamental sin to me.
____________________________________
From: dialogue-bounces at wedgeblade.net
[mailto:dialogue-bounces at wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of McCabe, Diann A
Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2008 12:11 PM
To: dialogue at wedgeblade.net
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Fact Check re: Obama
Nicholas Kristof says what I had wanted to say:
_http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/opinion/09kristof.html?th&emc=th_
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/09/opinion/09kristof.html?th&emc=th)
--Diann McCabe
____________________________________
From: McCabe, Diann A
Sent: Fri 3/7/2008 1:57 PM
To: Diann McCabe
Subject: FW: [Dialogue] Fact Check re: Obama
------ Forwarded Message
From: Karl Hess <khess at apk.net>
Reply-To: Colleague Dialogue <dialogue at wedgeblade.net>
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 17:45:53 -0500
To: Colleague Dialogue <dialogue at wedgeblade.net>
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Fact Check re: Obama
Diann,
"Enlighten" is part of the problem. In my view a big part. If you read
"The Political Brain" by Drew Westen, you will see that there is abundant data
showing that people make up their reasons to support their prejudices. Ben
Franklin said it well, "So convenient a thing it is to be a rational creature,
since it enables us to find or make a reason for everything one has a mind
to." The guy who wrote "What's the Matter with Kansas" thought the way most
liberals have thought for the last 40 years and that's why the Republicans have
won most of the presidential elections. Obama gets it. I don't think
Hilary does.
I've read several books on neuropsychology recently and they all find the
same phenomenon. In fact one neuroeconomist found that the standard "rational
man" assumed by economists only applies to autistic people. That's why the so
many economics Nobels lately have gone to people who have been disproving
traditional economics assumptions. Economics turns out to be a philosophy
pretending to be a science. "Adam's Fallacy" is also a good read.
The people who "put this stuff out" are using the fear 'frame' to win
elections. If we continue to assume voters are going to be rational, they will
continue to win elections.
Karl
Yes, it's disturbing that whoever is putting out this stuff assumes that a
"Muslim" is someone to be feared and loathed. We have much work to do to
enlighten people about how we as "Christians" have many, many connections to the
Islamic faith.--Diann
On 3/6/08 1:29 PM, "facilitationfla at aol.com" <facilitationfla at aol.com>
wrote:
Thanks, Del,
Yes, this is disgusting. Another paper (similar to National Enquirer) had
a front page headline last month: "Obama's hidden ties to Al Queda". Last
week -- again on the front page it had a photo of a grizzled white guy with the
headline, "I slept with Obama". I went to the Publix store manager and told
him he shouldn't be selling such trash in our community.
Cynthia
This appeared in the newspaper February 28. I just hadn't had a chance to
send it on until now.
FACT CHECK
Some of the rumors and allegations about Barack Obama are clearly not true,
yet still spread, often anonymously.
1. A debunked chain e-mail circulating widely suggests he is hiding his
Islamic roots. It says he was sworn into the Senate on the Quran and turns his
back on the flag during the Pledge of Allegiance. Actually, he took his
Senate oath with his hand on a family Bible, and he says, "Whenever I'm in the
United States Senate, I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of
America."
2. Another false report says he attended a Muslim madrassa as a child in
Jakarta. Obama was born in Hawaii and moved to Indonesia when he was 6 to live
with his mother and stepfather. He returned to Hawaii when he was 10 to live
with his maternal grandparents. Interviews last year by the Associated
Press at the elementary school in Jakarta found that it is a public and secular
institution and has been open to students of all faiths since before Obama
attended in the late 1960s.
-----Original Message-----
From: Del Morrill <del at hypnocenter.com>
To: Order Ecumenical <OE at wedgeblade.net>
Sent: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 1:56 pm
Subject: Fact Check re: Obama
This appeared in the newspaper February 28. I just hadn't had a chance to
send it on until now.
FACT CHECK
Some of the rumors and allegations about Barack Obama are clearly not true,
yet still spread, often anonymously.
1. A debunked chain e-mail circulating widely suggests he is hiding his
Islamic roots. It says he was sworn into the Senate on the Quran and turns his
back on the flag during the Pledge of Allegiance. Actually, he took his
Senate oath with his hand on a family Bible, and he says, "Whenever I'm in the
United States Senate, I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of
America."
2. Another false report says he attended a Muslim madrassa as a child in
Jakarta. Obama was born in Hawaii and moved to Indonesia when he was 6 to live
with his mother and stepfather. He returned to Hawaii when he was 10 to live
with his maternal grandparents. Interviews last year by the Associated Press
at the elementary school in Jakarta found that it is a public and secular
institution and has been open to students of all faiths since before Obama
attended in the late 1960s. (from the Associated Press)
Del Hunter Morrill
3217 North Mason Ave
Tacoma, WA 98407 USA
H:(253)752-1506, O:(253)383-5757
_http://www.hypnocenter.com_ (http://www.hypnocenter.com/)
_<http://www.hypnocenter.com/>_ (http://www.hypnocenter.com/)
There can be nothing to frighten you if you refuse to be afraid. (Mahatma
Gandhi)
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So convenient a thing it is to be a rational creature, since it enables us
to find or make a reason for everything one has a mind to. - Ben Franklin
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