[Dialogue] ToP Methods

[Wayne Nelson]

"Terry Bergdall"  wrote:

> Wayne could post the thread on the Linked-In Group as it now stands and invite
> people to respond.
> 
- - - - - - - - - -
Done. It tool a lot of posts, but it¹s there on Linked In.

The name of the group on Linked In is ³ToP Trainers Network²

Try this:

* Go to - http://www.linkedin.com/
* Join or log in 
* Click ³Groups² on the left menu
* Click ³Find a Group² in the ³Groups Directory² on the right.
* Enter ToP Trainers Network into the search field on the right ­ under
³Search Groups² 
* When you find it on the list, click the name.
* Click ³Join the group² and follow the instructions.

I think it is a moderated group requiring permission to join. Bill Davis set
it up, I believe. 



I think the conversation can continue here as well.



My summary of the conversation to date

> To me, there are 2 key questions raised in this dialogue. Perhaps there are
> others, but these seem to be the primary threads. I think this conversation is
> more related to facilitation than training, but the membranes are somewhat
> porous. 
> 
> 1. How do we use the Existential ­ Experiential Aim in our ToP facilitation
> work? 
> * How do you determine it for a group?
> * How do you use it in preparing to facilitate?
> * How do you use it as the session is going on?
> * How do you use it in assessing the effectiveness, results and impact of the
> event? 
> 
> 2. What is the impact of ToP methods on individual and organizations.
> 
> * What is the ³Existential² impact of ToP facilitation?
> * Do people make basic changes in their relationship to the topic and to their
> group² 
> * Do ToP methods play a real role in making a culture change that is positive,
> progressive and leads to more human, humane, productive, healthy workplaces?


A couple thoughts 

I did not intend to spark anything like or even close to a debate when I
asked my question about the origins of the Rational and Existential Aims.
I¹m asking the question in order to work it into a paper on the foundations
of ToP methodology. I¹m trying to dig down to the understandings and sources
that led us to incorporate these elements into our work.  I want to work how
they can be best articulated and used in the 21st century. I can and am
reading the sources I mentioned. I am forming my own theories as I dig
around, but I know there are people in this group with longer memories and
greater understanding than mine and I¹d love to hear their wisdom. I am
deeply grateful for these comments, because they have all given me clues.

I¹m not sure the comparison between RS1 and ToP facilitation is an entirely
appropriate one.  They are quite different things - -  born in different
times, developed out of different strategies and created with different
groups in mind.  They have very different intents and making direct
comparisons is, to me, quite dicey.  Some connections do actually turn out
to be invalid. To make value judgments is certainly not my intent, nor do I
think it it is really in our interest. to do so. I remember Joe Slicker
recently saying something like, ³Celebrate what has been and let it go ­
utterly and completely. Live in the now and build for the future.²

To me, if you¹re teaching RS1, you have RS1 type existential objectives.  If
you¹re facilitating a workshop designed to shape a legislative / public
policy framework for wildlife management or create strategy for an assisted
living project or design a distance education program, your existential aim
is going to be related to the specifics of those situations  and the groups
involved in those inquiries ­ their reality ­ their history - their
contradictions ­ their opportunities ­ their mandates and intentions etc.
What you believe or pray to 5 times a day is irrelevant.

To try to have people embrace RS1 type understanding in a ToP facilitation
event would be so far off target to be almost laughable. If fact it would be
truly sad. How do you work out the existential questions your group is
facing? To me, trying to squeeze them into an RS1 mold would violate the
very nature of the understanding out of which the idea was created. It would
be taking an essentialistic approach - as if there were some eternal answers
somewhere and all people need to do is get in alignment with these eternal
truths. The approach we are working from is ontological. We look at what is
going on in the situation itself as it presents itself and work from that
point.  

I believe having access to the deep background of where these ideas came
from will help us do better work with our current clients. It will help them
address the ³inescapable life questions² that will make a difference for
that group and will last for them. It will be integrated into their work and
their life together.  If the groups we work with face the existential
questions raised by their own life situation in ways that are authentic and
produce results that make their workplace and the world they touch a more
human place, I don¹t give a rat¹s a** if they can recite the RS1 cannon or
any other philosophical ­ theological mumbo jumbo.

\\/ 

< >  < >  < >  < >  < >
Wayne Nelson - ICA Associates Inc
ICA - 416-691-2316 - - - Cell ­ 647-229-6910
http://ica-associates.ca


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