[Oe List ...] various charts

Thu Jun 29 15:13:09 EST 2006

Lee
I would like a copy also.
Thanks
Roy

-----Original Message-----
From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net] On
Behalf Of Lee
Sent: Thursday, June 29, 2006 1:57 PM
To: Order Ecumenical Community
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] various charts

I think my rationales are going to Frank alone.  I think.  If anyone  
else wants to see what I sent to Frank, holler.

Lee

On Jun 29, 2006, at 10:58 AM, Patricia Tuecke wrote:

> Lee,
> I saw Frank's original request on the ICA Dialogue list and was  
> going to
> forward it to you. Then when I went to the OE list, I was glad you had
> already begun a conversation with Frank. Many, I'm sure, will be  
> interested
> in your rationales, etc. Enjoy your coffee.
>
> Patricia Tuecke, Sierra Circle Consulting
> 775-333-6998.  ptuecke at nvbell.net
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net]  
> On Behalf
> Of Lee
> Sent: Thursday, June 29, 2006 7:59 AM
> To: Order Ecumenical Community
> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] various charts
>
> Yeah, this is what I was afraid of.  I will answer your questions,
> but it might take several emails.  Short questions do not necessarily
> lead to short answers.
>
> The fourth step, as an example of a long answer, has been bastardized
> to where the original Tactical Systems Chart is no longer in use.
> The cross gestalt did us all in and tied knots in the tails of all
> participants.  I've changed the fourth step as well.  I'll get to
> that later.
>
> I am going to get a cup of coffee and will address the Practical
> Vision chart in a bit.
>
> Lee
>
>
>
> On Jun 28, 2006, at 11:21 PM, frank bremner wrote:
>
>> My questions are short, Lee.
>>
>> 1)  What was the rationale for the Vision chart (LENS/epecially
>> HDP) being
>> as it was?  The key vision item to aim for being in the middle,
>> with main
>> supporting and lesser supporting items to the sides?  Anything else?
>>
>> 2)  What was the rationale for the Contradictions chart (as above)
>> being as
>> it was?  Having the most populous category on the left, decreasing
>> to the
>> least populous category on the right, and all else in between?
>> Anything
>> else?
>>
>> 3)  For the Proposals chart the Cultural items tended to be in the
>> middle,
>> with Social/Political items to one side, and Economic items to the
>> other
>> side.  Emphasis: the cultural is key.  Anything else?
>>
>> 4)  The Programmatic Chart reworked the Proposals into Programs
>> that suited
>> the territory and kinds of funding agencies.  I'd imagine that this
>> could
>> change if there were a change of government with a new arrangement of
>> government departments - teh same funding but from different
>> places.  And so
>> on.  Anything else?
>>
>> 5) Timeline.  Straightforward.  With a fairly time-constrained
>> event with
>> students I've had them place Proposal items horizontally on a
>> timeline: the
>> months of this year, then the first and second six-month periods of
>> next
>> year, then "after that".  I divided the timeline into three  
>> horizontal
>> streams: economic (about "resources etc"), political (about
>> "decisions and
>> discussions etc"), and cultural (about "values, symbols and
>> celebrations
>> etc").  I'd develop the Social Process categories further only if
>> necessary.
>>
>> 6) Tactics.  A detailed version of the Proposals or Programmatic
>> chart?
>>
>> I know it looks as if I've answered my own question ("We're not out
>> to teach
>> you anything you don't already know"), BUT I'm interested in any
>> fresh takes
>> on these categories from anyone who has been intimately involved
>> with them
>> on a week-by-week basis.
>>
>> My underlying issue/question has to do with acquainting students/
>> teachers
>> with the idea of using a chart to hold items, rather than a list.
>> Then
>> "What sort of chart?"  Why do you use a "bridge chart" for the
>> Vision and
>> not for the Proposals?  Are there other ways of doing it?
>>
>> In other words:
>> (1) give them something to work with in the current event/workshop
>> (2) suggest that "doing a visual chart" is important: a principle
>> within
>> this event/workshop
>> (3) suggest that their may be other charts that could fit each stage
>> (4) suggest why the charts in (1) were used
>> (5) back to (3): the charts in (1) are not written in stone: if
>> anyone has
>> an alternative, let's look at it
>>
>> A lot of this would tend to be done if I was able to work with the
>> student/teacher group over a period of time as a mentor.
>>
>> Any further ideas ?
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Frank Bremner
>>
>>
>>> From: Lee <leassoc at charter.net>
>>> Reply-To: Order Ecumenical Community  <oe at wedgeblade.net>
>>> To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe at wedgeblade.net>
>>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] various charts
>>> Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2006 09:33:23 -0700
>>>
>>> Yeah, that's plenty.  I could send you the entire facilitators
>>> manual, but, that might not answer any of your questions.  So, why
>>> don't you ask me a couple of specific questions on each of the five
>>> steps and I'll do my best to answer them.  Why don't you send a
>>> separate email for each set of questions rather than a dozen or so
>>> all at once.
>>>
>>> Lee
>>>
>> etc
>>
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