[Oe List ...] [Dialogue] ToP Methods

Thu Oct 8 14:39:17 CDT 2009

I still use objective aim and existential aim (sometimes translated to experiential aim) in my meeting module of my project management curriculum. It is generally embedded in team building and project reporting. I often say that it is the way to force yourself to brood about the team journey. It can lead to such decisions as letting the clowns loose  when everybody’s chin is on the ground or emphasizing the soberness of the situation as one might find at a children’s camp with a serious and scary epidemic. 

Carlos R. Zervigon, PMP

Zervigon International, Ltd.

817 Antonine St.

New Orleans, LA  70115  USA

504 894-9868 Mobile: 504 908-0762

carlos at zervigon.comoften 

http://www.zervigon.com

From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of James Wiegel
Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 7:27 AM
To: Colleague Dialogue; Order Ecumenical Community
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] [Dialogue] ToP Methods

So, here is my question:  Looking at facilitation as we developed it and compared to address your life pedagogy like in RS-1 and then compared to the impact which Joe could generate on individuals and groups -- are these all the same thing, or quite different things?

If more or less the same, how would you describe this at its best?  Has this style of evangelism evolved and become refined or has it gotten watered down?

If different, how, and which are needed these days?

Jim

Coincidence is the spiritual equivalent of a pun. G. K. Chesterton

Jim Wiegel
401 North Beverly Way, Tolleson, Arizona 85353-2401
+1 623-936-8671 +1 623-363-3277
jfwiegel at yahoo.com www.partnersinparticipation.com

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From: W. J. <synergi at yahoo.com>
To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe at wedgeblade.net>; dialogue at wedgeblade.net
Sent: Tue, October 6, 2009 7:17:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] ToP Methods

You can see why there were different Gospels in the Bible, and that was long before Wiegel was summoned to the Holy Land to preach his revised standard version of the Facilitator's Gospel. "Experiential Aim"? Where did that come from? Isn't that the new Liberalism creeping in to dilute the authentic EI Orthodoxy? Everybody who knew JWM knows it is "Existential Aim" -- and you better believe it really addressed your existence just to be around the Old Man.

And the "O" in ORID -- wasn't that originally just "Impressionistic"? And wasn't "R" originally "Subjective"? And wasn't "D" originally "Theological"? So ORID = ISIT?

Ah, the problems of generational transmission of the authentic received canonical tradition! (Big Clue: I'm laughing!)

Marshall

>From where I sit, ORID reminds me of King Henry's death sentence pronounced on Thomas Becket: "Will no One RID me of this meddlesome priest?" Or something like that.

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From: James Wiegel <jfwiegel at yahoo.com>
To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe at wedgeblade.net>; Colleague Dialogue <dialogue at wedgeblade.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 6, 2009 3:33:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] ToP Methods

As I recall, these were an old, old idea.  When we were putting together the ToP curriculum with those horizontal bubble tables we added in Rational Objective and Experiential objective to the manuals -- after 3 or 4 years someone expressed confusion between Rational "Objective" and Experiential "Objective" and "Objective" as in ORID, so when the manual was redone we changed to Rational Aim and Experiential Aim.

In actuality, though, there is a very rich and wise diversity in the ways by which ToP facilitators actually focus and prepare themselves.  It would be a great contribution to our craft to hear from many people how they do this . . 

Jim

Coincidence is the spiritual equivalent of a pun. G. K. Chesterton

Jim Wiegel
401 North Beverly Way, Tolleson, Arizona 85353-2401
+1 623-936-8671 +1 623-363-3277
jfwiegel at yahoo.com www.partnersinparticipation.com

  _____  

From: Wayne Nelson <wnelson at ica-associates.ca>
To: Colleague Dialogue <dialogue at wedgeblade.net>; Order Ecumenical <oe at wedgeblade.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 6, 2009 3:23:46 PM
Subject: [Oe List ...] ToP Methods

Here’s a memory question – maybe something you heard.

When, how and why did we introduce the ideas of using Rational and Existential aims when we prepare for a facilitated event or a training event?

Does anyone know that history? I’m curious.

\\/
< >  < >  < >  < >  < > 
Wayne Nelson - ICA Associates Inc
ICA - 416-691-2316 - - - Cell – 647-229-6910
http://ica-associates.ca

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