[Oe List ...] Canadian Health System

Thu Sep 3 18:21:21 CDT 2009

How many of our projections, government, scientific institutions,  
universities, think tanks, etc. have been accurate?  I remember in the  
70's projections of little oil by the 90's, full employment in the  
90's, great reductions in poverty, etc.  None of these have been  
close.  I've consulted for a few companies that hired folks, who  
produced very rosy projections based on "the data."  A couple of them  
are no longer in being.    I recall one of the church consultants who  
projected that the inner city churches I worked with in the 80's would  
be closed in 5 years, by the data.  They are all still going.  What is  
the role of projections?

George Holcombe
14900 Yellowleaf Tr.
Austin, TX 78728
Home: 512/252-2756
Mobile 512/294-5952
geowanda at earthlink.net

On Sep 3, 2009, at 5:19 PM, Jack Gilles wrote:

> Bob,
>
> I agree with all of your points.  But there does seem to be at least  
> SOME people in Canada who are claiming that the present system is  
> not sustainable.  From what I've read (limited for sure) there are  
> people calling for some type of overall or adjustments to keep all  
> the points you mention fully functioning.  It may be years away from  
> a crisis, but is it or is it not true that there are issues on its  
> long range sustainability including Provincial funding abilities?   
> That's what I'd like to hear from you who obviously is much more  
> aware of the future of Canadian health systems than most of us.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jack
> On Sep 3, 2009, at 4:43 PM, Sandra Rafos wrote:
>
>> Well, well, well, I am sorely disappointed to hear that my health  
>> care system is on the verge of collapse.  Someone should inform the  
>> Canadian citizenry rather than trying to mislead the people of the  
>> US.  As a dual citizen I am deeply appreciative of the Health Care  
>> system in Canada.
>>
>> 1.  Everyone is covered, even landed immigrants, i.e non-citizens.
>>
>> 2.  Service is provided through your primary physician.  The choice  
>> of a physician is entirely yours.
>>
>> 3.  The primary physician provides treatment and determines the  
>> seriousness of your illness or injury.
>>
>> 4.  Critical and life threatening cases are referred to hospitals  
>> and specialists and treated immediately.
>>
>> 5.  Referrals to specialists for non-life threatening cases wait  
>> for treatment or services.
>>
>> 6.  Annual exams are free as well as a host of preventative tests;  
>> mammograms, ekgs, colonoscopy, blood and urine analysis, chest x- 
>> rays, bone density scans, etc.
>>
>> 7.  Hospitals and doctors are private.
>>
>> 8.  Fees for procedures are established by the Health Care system,  
>> and doctors and hospitals are reimbursed through it.
>>
>> 9.  All procedures and semi-private hospital room is paid by the  
>> Health Care system.
>>
>> 10.  The price of drugs is established by the government.
>>
>> 11.  Over 65 there is no charge for drugs.  Younger than 65, there  
>> may be modest co-pay.
>>
>> 12.  Many people carry supplemental health care for dental,  
>> eyeglasses, massage, chiropractor, private room, travel out-of- 
>> country, etc.
>>
>> 13.  People CANNOT sue their doctor.  Malpractice cases are handled  
>> through a board of doctors and health officials.  The out come of  
>> judgements can be fines, suspension of a license for a period of  
>> time, or loss of a license permanently.
>>
>> 14.  Ergo, there is no hefty malpractice insurance that has to be  
>> carried by doctors, which goes a long way to reducing medical costs.
>>
>> I have had knee surgery, eye surgery, surgery for pre-cancer  
>> conditions, treatment for shingles, flu shots, medications and have  
>> never paid for anything.
>>
>> This is not just for me or my family but for everyone.  I sleep  
>> well at night knowing that my friends and neighbors (known or  
>> unknown to me) are covered.
>>
>> My personal view is that healthcare is a RIGHT for everyone, just  
>> like a child has a right to an education, or people have a right to  
>> clean water, electricity, fuel for home, highways, police and fire  
>> protection, etc.  All of the above are provided for or regulated by  
>> the government.  This is a moral issue, not a financial one, and I  
>> hope Obama has the courage to take it to the mat.
>>
>> I am also clear that if you want a universal system, then it has to  
>> be paid for.  Taxes in Canada are high, and the burden falls  
>> heaviest on the wealthiest.  It is a fair system, and the cost of  
>> care per citizen is about 1/2 that of the US and life expectancy is  
>> higher than that of the US.  I have never heard of a family in  
>> Canada having to go bankrupt, because they couldn't pay their  
>> medical bills.
>>
>> With respect,
>>
>> Bob Rafos
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2-Sep-09, at 8:02 PM, Susan Fertig wrote:
>>
>>> I heard it repeated several times on different media late last  
>>> week -- I'll try to find out which Canadian minister it was who  
>>> was quoted.  Did none of you in ICA Canada hear this?
>>>
>>> Susan
>>>
>>>
>>> From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net]  
>>> On Behalf Of LAURELCG at aol.com
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 11:22 AM
>>> To: oe at wedgeblade.net
>>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A Matter of Human Rights
>>>
>>> In a message dated 9/1/2009 9:31:24 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, susan at gmdtech.com 
>>>  writes:
>>> Canada has already proclaimed that its health system is  
>>> unsustainable and has warned the U.S. against using it as a model.
>>> I wasn't aware of this, Susan. Do you have a source?
>>> Thanks,
>>> Jann
>>>
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