[Oe List ...] WH deal with PhRMA, delayed response to Ed

Wed Sep 9 10:00:11 CDT 2009

Don,

I appreciate the responses of all of you.  My questions to Susan were in
response to some of the things Susan has said.  Susan believes, as I
understand it, that conservatives have the mission to preserve the best of
what we have.  I wondered if the legitimacy of the conservative point of
view wasn't being absconded with and has been lost due to various factors
including big money.

I think Susan may be working out answers to these things I asked. My point
is that when there are issues of corruption and waste as big as we have,
there may actually be a common ground for legitimate conservatives and real
liberals.  Especially, this may be true when special interest, big,
super-big money doesn't obscure the issues.

2009/9/9 Bill Schlesinger <pvida at whc.net>

>  Whether we call it ‘public option,’ or ‘three-share’ or ‘universal
> access,’  there’s no way to cover health care for low income folk without
> public funding.  We’re doing it now – costly, ineffective, and rationed by
> physical access – through emergency departments and uninsured inpatient
> costs written off in hospitals.  We’re also continuing to see a
> disproportionate number of bankruptcies linked to health costs – often
> avoidable.  We can’t get to a basic level of care for everyone from the
> private sector alone or we’d already be there.
>
>
>
> As far as serving undocumented immigrants:  Will virus and bacteria not
> communicate from undocumented persons because of the lack of documents?  Any
> public health linked service cannot screen out undocumented folk without
> compromising the entire population.  It can’t ‘chill’ their access by
> reporting, enforcing, or even asking about their documented status.  That’s
> why the Border Patrol has marked clinics as ‘off limits’ to their vehicles
> let alone actual entry.
>
>
>
> Bill Schlesinger
> Project Vida
> 3607 Rivera Ave
> El Paso, TX 79905
> (915) 533-7057 x 207
> (915) 490-6148 mobile
> (915) 533-7158 fax
> bschlesinger.pv at tachc.org
> www.projectvidaelpaso.org
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> *From:* oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net] *On
> Behalf Of *Ellen & David Rebstock
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 08, 2009 11:49 PM
> *To:* Order Ecumenical Community
> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] WH deal with PhRMA, delayed response to Ed
>
>
>
> Dr. Don,
> Just to change the subject a bit.  What do you think about these points in
> the Washington Post that seem to be written from the Doctors and Hospital
> perspective.http .  //
> www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/04/AR2009090402274.html?wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter10 Things I hate about Health Care Reform
>
> Also another Post article about "why Liberals should drop the Public
> Option" today is also good
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/07/AR2009090702070.html?wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter
> I'm pretty liberal and have been and have experienced the high cost of
> medicine for the last two years.  I've been for single payer or Public
> Option all along but would give up on it if I felt we could just accomplish
> Obama's overall objectives of Universal Care, No pre-existing restrictions,
> costs go down all the way around by whatever means and get at least some of
> the  10 things in the list in the first article  like
> 1. Real regulation of insurance companies and yet a real competitive
> environment.
> 2. Limits on compensation in suits
> 3. Subsidies for education of med students especially those going into
> family practice.
> 4. Not cutting payments to doctors
> 5. Not cutting reimbursements to hospitals so they have to shut down.  But
> they need to cut costs too.  The patient records and mechanization in UCal
> Hospitals is terrible, stone age. They can't find anything.  You virtually
> have to bring your own records with you. Yet every records station is
> grossly overstaffed because the records are still in manila folders
> Including the CDs for MRIs etc.
> 6. Doctors incentives for quality.
>
> What I hate most about the discussion that is going on is on both sides say
> "I've got mine, the hell with you"
>
> Dave Rebstock
>
>
>
>
>
> Dave Rebstock
>
> 2009/9/8 Don Elliott <dpelliott at aol.com>
>
>
>
> Ed,
>
>
>
> Your question to Susan.
>
>
>
> IV. You have not said anything about the flood of money going to Congress
>
> and corruption that happens with wink and a nod rather than outright buying
>
> of votes.  Is there any Conservative outrage about this kind of sneaky
>
> corruption?
>
>  You challenged Susan to say something about the flood of money going to
> Congress in exchange for favorable treatment.  You seem to imply that that
> is a problem of conservatism.  I am providing a link to an article by a
> liberal columnist who is outraged by the deal made between PhRMA and the WH
> which prevents government from negotiating for lower drug prices on the
> basis of volume buying.  Medicare Canada has negotiated for and received
> huge volume discounts.  You can order American made drugs from Canada for a
> fraction of their cost from US pharmacies, so-called reimportation.  The
> Medicare drug bill passed by a Democratic congress under GWB was roundly
> criticised for not allowing negotiated lower drug prices, and now we find
> the Obama WH has done the same thing.
>
>
>
> Surprise, the article has been removed from Robert Reich's blog,  I tried
> posting the entire article, but exceeded my 40kb max.  I will send the full
> article to anyone who wants it.
>
>
>
> Here is a brief excerpt:
>
>
>  *Robert Reich's Blog <http://robertreich.blogspot.com/>* *Sunday, August
> 09, 2009*
>  *How the White House's Deal With Big Pharma Undermines Democracy *
>
> *I'm a strong supporter of universal health insurance, and a fan of the
> Obama administration. But I'm appalled by the deal the White House has made
> with the pharmaceutical industry's lobbying arm to buy their support.
>
> Last week, after being reported in the Los Angeles Times, the White House
> confirmed it has promised Big Pharma that any healthcare legislation will
> bar the government from using its huge purchasing power to negotiate lower
> drug prices. That's basically the same deal that George W. Bush struck in
> getting the Medicare drug benefit, and it's proven a bonanza for the drug
> industry. *
>
>
> *Let me remind you: Any bonanza for the drug industry means higher
> health-care costs for the rest of us*
>
>
> *In return, Big Pharma has budgeted $150 million for TV ads promoting
> universal health.
>
> I don't want to be puritanical about all this. Politics is a rough game in
> which means and ends often get mixed and melded. Perhaps the White House
> deal with Big Pharma is a necessary step to get anything resembling
> universal health insurance. But if that's the case, our democracy is in
> terrible shape.  We're on a precarious road -- and wherever it leads, it's
> not toward democracy.*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The Deal, (from the Huffington Post)
>
> =0 A
>
>  The deal, as outlined in t he memo:
>
> Commitment of up to $80 billion, but not more than $80 billion.
>
> 1. Agree to increase Medicaid rebate from 15.1 - 23.1% ($34 billion)
>
> 2. Agree to get FOBs done (but no agreement on details — express
> disagreement on data exclusivity which
>
> both sides say does not affect the score of  the legislation.) ($9 billion)
>
> 3. Sell drugs to patients in the donut hole at 50% discount ($25 billion)
> This totals $68 billion
>
> 4. Companies will be assessed a tax or fee that will score at $12 billion.
> There was no agreement as to how or
>
> on what this tax/fee will be based.
>
> Total: $80 billion
>
>
>
> In exchange for these items, the White House agreed to:
>
> 1. Oppose importation
>
> 2. Oppose rebates in Medicare Part D
>
> 3. Oppose repeal of non-interference
>
> 4. Oppose opening Medicare Part B
>
>
>
> Where is your outrage over this?  Is this an example of  "everybody's doing
> it", "secondary integrity", or "the end justifies the means"?
>
>
>
>
> Don Elliott
>
>
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