[Oe List ...] Salmon: Reply to the Bishops, et al

[Isobel and Jim Bishop]

Hey Bill, and colleagues,
I agree with you-  especially about the Heart and Gut analysis method.
Mainly I wrote the bit about the Clergy at the Common Dreams  
Conference because it saddened me to think that these blokes were  
going to wait another few years until retirement before they launched  
themselves as Progressives.
Anyway, c'est la vie.  The new forms of discussing the Christian  
faith will not go away now.
John Dominic Crossan is coming to Melbourne in late August, so the  
Victorians will be very well served by him.
Best to you all,
Isobel BIshop.

On 28/04/2010, at 1:39 PM, William Salmon wrote:

> Bishops!
>    Your comment concerning the clergy piqued my interest, and I can  
> sympathize with their views that their congregation could be upset  
> applying the principles of "Progressive Theology."
>    The chief lesson I've learned is that most pastors are no  
> further along in Christian maturity than their laity. Our  
> professional schools have done a lousy job in helping pastors to  
> ground their theology. Consequently, to ask either a layperson, or  
> a pastor, to define what they mean by God, Christ, Holy Spirit,  
> Church, Blood of Jesus, or whatever, they all have equal amount of  
> difficulty.
>    The answer is so rudimentory. Simply ask, "Tell me how you  
> EXPERIENCE God, Christ, Holy Spirit, etc." Immediately this  
> question moves the conversation from a Head Trip Analysis to a Gut  
> Trip Analysis."
>    A person can reply, "God is experienced as love."
>    "Alright, tell me the last time you were loved?"
>    "Well, it was when my spouse forgave me for being a damned fool."
>    Now everyone knows the experience of being a fool. Note that the  
> conversation has moved from a Head Trip Analysis to a Gut Trip  
> Analysis."
>    This works everytime, just refuse to dwell in a Head Trip  
> conversation by gently pushing to the experiential.
>    This conversation technique works with any all all kinds of  
> people; it works with those who are Christian, non-Christian, other  
> worldly/spiritual people as well as atheists.
>    There is nothing controversial about it.
>    Concerning Social Issues "help each one you meet to make a new  
> decision." The ethical model for Christians is WWJD, and What Would  
> Niebuhr Say?
>      I can wax eloquent on the need to live the surrendered life  
> fulfilling our intended creation living as humane and gracious  
> people working for justice and mercy. At this time, I won't
>      What do you think? Usually when I do this I open a can of  
> worms. But, what the hell, ain't I a Salmon, and you now what  
> Salmon do when they swim upstream." I say this just to egg you on.
>    Inner peace.
>    Bill
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Isobel and Jim Bishop"  
> <isobeljimbish at optusnet.com.au>
> To: "Order Ecumenical Community" <oe at wedgeblade.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 8:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Common Dreams Conference # 2 held  
> recently inMelbourne.
>
>
>> Dear Ruth, Herman and Ellie, and colleagues all,
>> One of the things which really struck me about this Conference was
>> that, right at this moment it is the Clergy  for whom we could well
>> be especially mindful.  In the first Breakout group I was sitting
>> with a bunch of mostly Clergy, who were agonising about how to
>> introduce some new ways of theologising and discussing Scripture in
>> their various congregations. They were saying things like " I will
>> wait until I am retired to start talking about Progressive
>> Christianity...  and If I did talk like this my congregation would
>> be most unhappy.. "  etc.,etc.,  So I discovered that support
>> networks are very important for those who are fostering " the new
>> way..."
>>  In about 4 weeks time the lead speakers will send us the notes of
>> their talks..  I will be happy to send them on to the general
>> listserve...  there will be about  4 or 5 all told-   or I could send
>> to the three folk listed above....
>>
>> In peace,
>> Isobel Bishop.
>> On 25/04/2010, at 9:30 AM, Ruth Landmann wrote:
>>
>>> Isobel,  thank you so much for your reflections and for sharing The
>>> Centre for Progressive Christianity web site. I forwarded that link
>>> to my fellow members of our church's Church and Society committee.
>>> It turns out that our pastor heard the director of the TCPC speak a
>>> few months ago in Berkeley and is very interested in our church
>>> getting involved. A couple other members of the committee also
>>> responded very positively.
>>> Thanks again!
>>>  G & P
>>> Ruth Landmann
>>> -- 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
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