[Oe List ...] Very close to the indicative is the imperative

Sat Nov 27 13:31:26 CST 2010

Herman,

Does anyone in fact "see the world as it is"?   Doesn't everyone rather "see the world as they see the world."  I.e., is there any world view that is not subjective?  I would caution that our "views of the world," much like our "stories of reality," are not "the world" and are not "reality."  They are our views and stories.  In fact, isn't that what Brooks is trying to say about Tolstoy, that he forgot, or never knew, that his views and stories were perceptions, and thus presented them as the "real thing" and insisted that everyone receive them as such?  My guess is that Tolstoy did not allow people to see the world as it is, but rather to see it as he saw it.

Help me out here.  I may be way off base.

Randy

--- On Sat, 11/27/10, Herman Greene <hfgreene at mindspring.com> wrote:

From: Herman Greene <hfgreene at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Very close to the indicative is the imperative
To: "'Order Ecumenical Community'" <oe at wedgeblade.net>
Date: Saturday, November 27, 2010, 10:47 AM

I was thinking more about Tolstoy’s power of description as a novelist and as explained by Brooks. Nothing more. 
His description, became the imperative (framed every subsequent choice).

I didn’t think of his description as having a subjective bias so one is led to “see the world as Tolstoy saw it” rather I thought Tolstoy’s description allowed peoples to see the world as it is. 

Herman 

From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2010 11:39 AM
To: ' Order Ecumenical Community '
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Very close to the indicative is the imperative

Hmmm, maybe I didn’t quite understand what Brooks was saying. I can often be persuaded to understand another’s point of view (see the world as he does) without adopting it; and while I’d like to think that if I understand the other point of view I would then consider it in subsequent decisions, I can’t say that is always the case. But I like Jim’s observation that once you engage your reality changes. 

Susan

From: oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces at wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of James Wiegel
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2010 8:27 AM
To: Order Ecumenical Community
Cc: Order Ecumenical Community
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Very close to the indicative is the imperative

He kind of makes the case for poets and activists living in separate worlds, and for the human agony that you can't do much as an observer, and once you engage in doing something,  what you see is way different . . .

Jim Wiegel

Jfwiegel at yahoo.com

On Nov 26, 2010, at 7:36, "Herman Greene" <hgreene at greenelawnc.com> wrote:

This quote from David Brook’s Op-Ed today:

“In middle age, it was as a novelist that Tolstoy achieved his most lasting influence. After all, description is prescription. If you can get people to see the world as you do, you have unwittingly framed every subsequent choice.” 

 http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/26/opinion/26brooks.html?_r=1&hp 
_____________________________________________ 
Herman F. Greene, Esq. 
Greene Law, PLLC 
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Skype: hgreene-nc 
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